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Goldberg Husky 400, Surge 400 without flaps?

Old 02-19-2007, 03:45 PM
  #1  
nk1851
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Default Goldberg Husky 400, Surge 400 without flaps?

I think I want a smaller trainer/intermediate electric plane. Have been looking at Goldberg and found these, but they say they need a 5 channel Tx, for flap control, and I only have a 4 channel radio.
Question is, can I build either of these planes with the flaps disconnected, and possibly add them later when and if I get a better radio?
How do you think they will fly without flaps?
Thanks,
Nick
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Old 02-27-2007, 05:13 AM
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Hemmi101
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Default Surge 400 flaps

I have the Goldberg surge 400 without flaps. I simply epoxied the flap to aileron, I can't imagine why you would need flaps on that plane. I have a e-flite 400 outrunner, 18a castle/thunderbird esc, and use a thunder power 1320 3s battery. It flies beautifully--I think better than my slightly larger e-flite mini stik with 450 (didn't use flaps on that one either.)
Enjoy.
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Old 02-27-2007, 12:43 PM
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Solid Hit
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There are many planes that have the option for flaps. In a plane the size of the Goldberg kits, they are more for show. They will have some effect but not nearly what they will do for a larger plane.

I flew the Mini Ultra Stick, which has the option built in the wing, without flaps. I programed my radio to mimic flaps using the ailerons and never really found the use for them.
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Old 03-19-2008, 01:45 AM
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BMitchely
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Default After a 10 Minute Search

Originally Posted by Hemmi101 View Post
I have the Goldberg surge 400 without flaps. I simply epoxied the flap to aileron, I can't imagine why you would need flaps on that plane. I have a e-flite 400 outrunner, 18a castle/thunderbird esc, and use a thunder power 1320 3s battery. It flies beautifully--I think better than my slightly larger e-flite mini stik with 450 (didn't use flaps on that one either.)
Enjoy.
That is just the info I was looking for! That was quick and easy... I just piled up my Edge 540 and picked up the Goldberg Model from a shop in Charlottesville, VA. I was jonesing purdy bad for a aerobat man...
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Old 03-19-2008, 01:24 PM
  #5  
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Just a quick question to Hemmi101, which E-flite 400 did you use, the 740 or the 920?
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Old 03-20-2008, 11:57 PM
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Hemmi101
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Default goldberg surge 400

My E-flite 400 is, I believe the 920. I use a 9-6 prop. I am able to take off from my pump box which is 2 1/2 ft square, (the surface is 3 feet in the air, which gives a little advantage.)

Incidently, Tower has these on sale for 39.99 including a free hat. I paid $59 for mine!--regards, Earl

PS I am now using a thunder power 11.1v 900ham lipo for less weight.

Last edited by Hemmi101; 03-20-2008 at 11:58 PM. Reason: new thought
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:00 PM
  #7  
wahoo
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Default Surge 400

Hi All,

I see this thread is quite a few months old but I just picked up a Surge 400.

I have a question for Hemmi101 regarding the weight of the plane.

You stated in your first post
"It flies beautifully--I think better than my slightly larger e-flite mini stik with 450"
Then you said that you went to a lighter battery for less weight in your next post, why did you do that ?

Reason I'm asking is the motor you used weighs 2oz. The motor I'm using weighs 2.7 and I'm also using a CC 36 amp esc. which is only slightly heavier and I'm also planning on using 4 servos in the wing.

When you glued the flaps to the 'rons did you go with just 2 servos ?

I was planning on using my TP 1320's but I'm not sure now. I didn't really want to buy new packs for this plane.

Thanks,
John
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Old 12-08-2008, 01:56 PM
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I HAD one (showing off on a low level inverted pass created a mass of balsa confetti...) It flew awesome. I actually moved the landing gear forward (one of my first planes and removal of the gear was rather abrupt) and made room for 2200mah 3s packs. I was running an exceed 400 with 10x7 apc. It was a GREAT plane. I had the flaps hooked up but rarely used them. This plane is too small to actually need them. Even without the flaps you can land at very slow speeds. Probably responds better at low speeds without them by putting the ailerons directly in the prop wash. Have fun! I am planing to rebuild my pretty pink plane! I think the color scheme is 90% of why they did not sell many.
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Old 12-08-2008, 08:06 PM
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Yea BirdDog the colour is rather "Girly" but I still have mine and it flies great! Using the E-Flite 400 and a 3 cell 1350 Lipo. I can get about 24 minutes of lazy flight or get stupid for about 15. I hooked the flaps and ailerons together and it will fly at a crawl...
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Old 12-08-2008, 10:42 PM
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So it seems that most of the 3 or 4 people that actually bought one of these 'girly' planes are only using 2 servos in the wing huh ? LOL

I couldn't care less what the color or even what the airframe looks like. I bought it for the fact that I wanted to try out the speed brake feature on my 9C radio.

I bought a brand new 76" H9 ultrastick size wing off eBay dirt cheap and it has the option of just ailerons or flaps and 'rons.

I plan on building a profile fuse for it and wanted to try out 'crow' on something before I build the profile.

The H9 ailerons/flaps are all one piece and the wing has 4 servo pockets that are still covered so if I want to try out the flaps and ailerons I'd have to cut the flaps off the 'rons and open up all four servo holes.

I just thought the surge 400 would give me an idea on what to expect with a 4 aileron wing. Besides I already had all the gear for it.

John
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Old 12-09-2008, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by wahoo View Post
I bought a brand new 76" H9 ultrastick size wing off eBay dirt cheap and it has the option of just ailerons or flaps and 'rons.
Sounds like a nice plane. At that size the flaps should work nicely.
I know a guy (with a more advanced radio) who set up a giant scrathbuilt stick up real cool.
He can set the flaps up and drive around on the ground at about 40mph. He also is set where he can set the flaps up and the ailerons down. The plane stops in the air as if it hit a wall. He is the one who told me about mixing in some elevator to offset the "balooning" when I deploy the flaps. Didn't really make much difference on the little Goldberg but I am sure it would be evident on a larger plane.
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Old 12-09-2008, 08:32 PM
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Gonna Crow an Ultrastick huh. Good Lord that seem with such a draggy, and lightly loaded airframe, it would be akin to yanking up the parking brake on one of those old Toyota Tercels. Slows down so fast, it is almost comical, all while trying to pass itself. You must post a video of this...

Ah yes Do mix in a bit of elevator with the Surge. It pitches forward quite a bit and with full throw, I run out of elevator in a flare. I have a Hitec Eclipse and I want to say with I have about 8% UP Elevator. It does not balloon to badly and the stick remains at neutral.
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Old 01-01-2009, 06:02 AM
  #13  
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Default DON'T glue the flaps to the ailerons!

Originally Posted by wahoo View Post
So it seems that most of the 3 or 4 people that actually bought one of these 'girly' planes are only using 2 servos in the wing huh ? LOL

I couldn't care less what the color or even what the airframe looks like. I bought it for the fact that I wanted to try out the speed brake feature on my 9C radio.

I bought a brand new 76" H9 ultrastick size wing off eBay dirt cheap and it has the option of just ailerons or flaps and 'rons.

I plan on building a profile fuse for it and wanted to try out 'crow' on something before I build the profile.

The H9 ailerons/flaps are all one piece and the wing has 4 servo pockets that are still covered so if I want to try out the flaps and ailerons I'd have to cut the flaps off the 'rons and open up all four servo holes.

I just thought the surge 400 would give me an idea on what to expect with a 4 aileron wing. Besides I already had all the gear for it.

John
I've had two of the CG Surge 400's - one when they came out a couple years ago and bought another a few months ago. I've kept the flap fully functional on this second one and for a very good reason. But first this - if you are just going to fart around flying or do some basic acro, them glue the flaps to the wing, NOT the ailerons. Two reasons - you increase the wing area even more and the ailerons are already big enough for this kind of flying. This is what I did to my first Surge 400 and everyone who flew it, including a lot of old timers at our club, loved the control and wing area it had. You hardly need anymore control surface unless .....

... you want to do serious 3D, which is what the flaps are for, NOT landing even slower! Between the time period of my first and my current Surge 400, I've gotten really into 3D and the flaps are a killer for a lot of maneuvers that require extremely slow speed ... falling leaf, rudder turns on a dime, even hanging on the prop, etc. Most large 3D birds have flaps for this reason and my little "sensitive colored" Surge 400 has embarrassed carbon fibre birds than cost 20 times the cost I paid for them (around $50 each ARF)

I'm running a 190w 1750kv "bell type" EMax Brushless direct drive, 1500mAh 3S Zippy these days. 5g servos for the Flaps, 9g for the Ailerons and Rudder/Elev. 15 minute flight (4+ min warm up / 10 minute exhibition)

Ps. Ditto on the ailerons mix as the above post indicates, but 5% up Elev.

Radio - Airtronics RD8000
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Old 01-06-2009, 01:48 PM
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wahoo
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Hello again,

Before I got the electric bug I found out that what I thought were the UGLIEST planes in the world happen to fly better than anything else I've ever came across and that would be Profiles.

So to you birdDog and BMitchely I don't own a complete Ultrastick... just a wing for it that I came across on ebay. Cheap too for a 75" fun fly wing might I add.

So what I plan on doing is using blue construction foam found at most home improvement stores to scratch out a profile fuse for it.

But it does indeed have the option for 4 servos. The 2 servo bays in each half of the wing are still covered with the original white ultracote.
What's nice about the wing is the ailerons are all one piece right now so if I would go with the option of not using flaps I would only open up one servo bay on each side. If I want ailerons and flaps I would need to physically cut the flaps off of the ailerons and open up both servo bays in each half of the wing. NICE!!

On the other hand I also have a World Models FunWorld 3D that also uses 4 servos in the wing... thing is, it came just like the Surge (2 ailerons 2 flaps) so if I choose to not use the flap option I would have to do just like those with the Surge did and connect them together.

I haven't assembled the FW3D or the scratchbuilt Fuse for the US wing so when I came across the "little plane of a funny color" for the price I paid for it, it was a no brainer.
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Old 01-06-2009, 02:14 PM
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For such a BIG wing I would even consider a balsa profile fuse. I am planning to do that with surge 400 wings and also a cheap extra 330 I bought off e-bay that was so out of square that I never got it to fly right. I wound up stomping the fuse into toothpicks at the field one day. The wing still looks good. For a larger sport plane I am concerned the blucor might have too much flex.
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Old 01-06-2009, 06:50 PM
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wahoo
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I didn't give any details for the profile fuse because its sorta "off topic" and one of the other sites (where I more or less just lurk) frowns upon off topic chat. Even tho I think this is what a forum is all about.

Anyways I plan on using the the thick (1.5" - 2") blue foam just for the internal structure if you will. I'll use hardwood rails from the engine mount, through the landing gear area to the wing root.

I'll also add balsa stringers to critical areas, such as for mounting servos for rudder and elevators in the tail.

All this will be sandwiched between lite ply up front and balsa sheeting from the wing back.

Pretty much just like OMP does on their big profiles.
http://www.ohiomodelplanes.com/manua...nt_cutouts.jpg

http://www.ohiomodelplanes.com/manua...m_capping2.jpg


John

Last edited by wahoo; 01-06-2009 at 11:43 PM.
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Old 10-11-2009, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by wahoo View Post
I couldn't care less what the color or even what the airframe looks like. I bought it for the fact that I wanted to try out the speed brake feature on my 9C radio.

I bought a brand new 76" H9 ultrastick size wing off eBay dirt cheap and it has the option of just ailerons or flaps and 'rons.

I plan on building a profile fuse for it and wanted to try out 'crow' on something before I build the profile.

John

Crow on Surge 400...
Far out man!
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