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Motor cuts out

Old 07-25-2011, 03:50 PM
  #1  
payne9999
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Default Motor cuts out

I am having a weird issue with a Park 480. I am using a 40 amp Horizon speed control in an RV-9. I have about 25 flights on it but the motor, speed control and plane are only 1 week old (been flying a lot). I think this is the best airplane I have ever flown and I don't want to lose it from some weird failure.

Once during straight and level flight the motor cut out but it was not real close in and the throttle was at half so I couldn't hear the prop noise to determine the motor speed. I wasn't so sure I had lost the motor and power came back in a few seconds. The second time was on takeoff. On departure at about 100 feet I went from 80% power to 0%. After about 5-8 seconds and many decisions about how to land with limited airspeed and space the power suddenly came back on.

I circled and landed quickly, opened the hatch and the receiver was not blinking (DSMx, AR600X). I am using a DSMx DX6i transmitter. So, because the receiver was not blinking, I am assuming I did not lose radio contact. I am wondering if the speed controller is having some sort of glitch. After about 72 minutes of total flight time I have only seen this twice but it really makes me wonder what could be causing it.

Dang, I thought I left the "dead Stick" thing behind with nitro!

Thanks,

Dave
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:19 PM
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dumo01
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Dave

Were you able to tell if had control of the flight surfaces or not? If it was only the motor that shut down that might tend to lead to one idea vs if the motor and control surfaces were also out.

Except for the light not flashing it sounds like a brown out, which could have several root causes
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:29 PM
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payne9999
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I did have solid flight control, had half my battery time left (battery has only been used 4-5 cycles) and the Rx and Tx are both new DSMx units (post recall). It was an E-Flite 2200 Mah 3S. If it browned out wouldn't the receiver be blinking afterwards? Also, I did a power run-up after landing for 45 seconds or so at almost full throttle and no cut-out occurred.

Thanks,

Dave
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Old 07-25-2011, 08:33 PM
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Stick it on the wattmeter - how many volts is the pack delivering at full throttle?

And what ESC exactly? I too have had some strange issues with E-Flite ESC's cutting and you have to drop to idle/cut then they power right back up. So did you go to cut then try power again?
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Old 07-25-2011, 09:21 PM
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It is just the standard E-Flite 40 amp ESC that they offer with their RV-9 and Park 480 motor. Yes I am pretty sure I throttled back to 0 to reset the ESC. In my panic I don't remember fore sure but since I was landing think I throttled back to make my approach.

Dave
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:42 PM
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road king 97
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I cant help you dave but i do have eflight esc,s but no problems with any of them . I will wait to hear what you find out ,might save me a a bad day at the field and a hole bunch of swear words. If i had to guess i would think a bad conection or the esc is shutting down from overheating or to big of a prop . joe
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Old 07-26-2011, 01:53 AM
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I'm am running the 11X7 that they recommended and sent with the package. Does that sound like the correct size/pitch?

O can check all the external connections but I don't want to dig inside the ESC in case it needs to be exchanged.

Called and emailed Horizon, waiting for a response.

Thanks,

Dave
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Old 07-26-2011, 02:36 AM
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dumo01
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I agree with you that if it were a brown out, you should have had a flash on the receiver light as well as you should not have maintained control of the flight surfaces.
I would go with Mike's suggestion of looking at the full throttle voltage delivered by the battery to see if the voltage sag is getting close to the LVC. Is the LVC programmable and maybe set higher than you think?

The other possibility is that you have a battery with one cell going south. I have a 4 s battery that behaved very similarly with only a few flights on it. Checked the individual cells and in spite of being being freshly charged and balanced, within a couple minutes of take off I had to do a dead stick due to one cell dropping out. But this does not exactly fit your circumstances since you had recovery of power.

Will be interested in hearing what HH has to say. Intermittent problems can be tough to find a for sure cause. My guess is that it will end up being something funky with the speed control
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Old 07-26-2011, 12:43 PM
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Dave i could not tell you what size props to use as iam still learning electrict flight myself. I know these new esc,s have a limiter to slow down or cut off if they sence a overload . Iam just throwing gueses out there to try. I have called HH before with good responce from them so hope they let you know somthing soon. joe
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Old 07-26-2011, 06:57 PM
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Walt Thyng
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Could be low voltage cut off or thermal shutdown.
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Old 07-26-2011, 08:11 PM
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HH says it could be the ESC or the motor, could be a loose wire in the motor. They suggested I do some bench testing and check it with a watt meter. I don't have a watt meter yet and don't have the test equipment to diagnose it.

They said I would have to return both units to them but they didn't think they would be able to diagnose such an intermittent problem.

So, I think I will replace the motor and ESC with a Turnigy 275-300 watt motor and a Plush 40 amp ESC. I have had no issues with Turnigy and the motors and ESC's perform really well (so far).

Dave
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Old 07-26-2011, 08:32 PM
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Dave just swap the ESC - I am pretty sure that is it.

And get a watt meter soon. Like working in the dark without one.
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Old 07-26-2011, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by payne9999 View Post
HH says it could be the ESC or the motor, could be a loose wire in the motor. They suggested I do some bench testing and check it with a watt meter. I don't have a watt meter yet and don't have the test equipment to diagnose it.

They said I would have to return both units to them but they didn't think they would be able to diagnose such an intermittent problem.

So, I think I will replace the motor and ESC with a Turnigy 275-300 watt motor and a Plush 40 amp ESC. I have had no issues with Turnigy and the motors and ESC's perform really well (so far).

Dave
Or, check out the Castle Creations 50 Amp ICE Lite ESC, for $99.00. More expensive than the ESC's you might be using. But, this one has a switching BEC (Battery Elimination Circuit) rated for 5 amps, eliminating the issue of the ESC voltage regulator shutting down.

And, this ESC records flight data, so you can play it back after a flight and find out exactly what's going on.

I've set mine to record volts/current/watts/RPM/Battery sag/power setting every second. That's enough to record over an hour of flight time.

http://www.castlecreations.com/produ...oenix_ice.html
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Old 08-02-2011, 08:57 PM
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Yesterday I bought a Castle 36 amp ESC. The Park 480 draws a maximum of 28 amps so I thought the 36 amp rating would be adequate.

So, I made several flights today and lots of touch and goes and saw no issues. I need to accumulate some more stick time to be sure but it seems the problem is gone for now.

Thanks,

Dave
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Old 08-02-2011, 09:01 PM
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Send the other one back dave e flight is great when it comes to its customers . joe
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Old 08-02-2011, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by payne9999 View Post
Yesterday I bought a Castle 36 amp ESC. The Park 480 draws a maximum of 28 amps so I thought the 36 amp rating would be adequate.

So, I made several flights today and lots of touch and goes and saw no issues. I need to accumulate some more stick time to be sure but it seems the problem is gone for now.

Thanks,

Dave
Hi Dave
I've got 7 CC ESC's, all work well. One thing I've done to all of them is reset the way the ESC shuts down the motor on low battery. The default setting is just shut the motor off. Then you've got to go to low throttle to get power back.

The CC ESC's have a motor option to just lower power to the motor, to maintain the battery at its minimum voltage. Then, don't fly more than about 60% of the battery on any flight, so if you've got to go around or what ever, you still have power left to do it.

Also, be sure to turn off the motor brake on low throttle, it's not needed, unless you're flying with a folding propeller on a sailplane. The brake function could unscrew your propeller. (Don't ask)

The CC ESC's can be programmed by twiddling the transmitter sticks per the CC manual, but picking up a CC ESC programmer is a far easier way to do it.

It's been my experience that the CC ESC's ratings are reasonable. You can run them at their rated current or maximum cell count with no concerns as long as you have some air flowing past them in flight. Just don't exceed their voltage rating or cell count rating. Doing so can cause very short life, or worse.

And if you're flying a larger model with four servos or so, consider the CC 10 amp uBEC (Switching Power Supply Battery Elimination Circuit). I've got a bunch of them. One of them is powering a giant scale 19 pound, 3000 watt model with seven Hitec 645MG servos. After some 60 flights, zero problems.
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