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spectrum and spectrum

Old 09-02-2015, 10:02 PM
  #1  
Dirky
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Default spectrum and spectrum

Hi,

Like mentioned in another thread, I've been away too long and plan a restart.

Scrolling through the datasheets of Spectrum transmitters, I kind of loose grip.
Dx6, Dx7, Dx8, Dx9,... I understand, the one has "more" than the other but is that one also "better"? Will a 9 fail less than a 6? Or is quality so good these days that all systems are 99.9999% failsafe?

thanks for all info!
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Old 09-02-2015, 10:23 PM
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None are any better or worse if you are talking new transmitters.

If you are looking at older stuff I would stay away from the older platforms and make sure it is DSMX technology. I have a JR 9303 that was upgraded to DSMX and can tell the difference for sure.

The biggest thing with Spektrum tech is to make sure you are providing ample power to the receiver.
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Old 09-03-2015, 08:36 AM
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With modern radio construction being near solid state, and widespread use if plastics etc. The brand of radio now really is a preference item. Reliability and performance of even low end budget radio is far better that some years ago.

I have a RL 6ch heli radio that basically sells for about $35 .... uses Futaba type Rx's .... its now about 5yrs in regular hard use .... still as the day I bought it.

My 9x's .... are yes old ... but still as good as new .... others who fly in same groups as me ... 9x's all working fine after many years. My 9xr's .... same story.

I'm not trying to convince to buy 9x or 9xr .... not getting into that never ending argument. My point is that modern radio is now so good, with even budget having features that make older top-end FM radios pale in comparison.
In fact I would even suggest that if a service organization needs to be maintained for a modern radio - then I question why given today's electronics. I cannot find a Sony ... Sanyo ... JVC .... Kenwood service center and certainly if there are - not as widely linked or quoted as some RC radio ones !
JR / McGregor maintained serious service center in UK because older FM gear had 'traditional' electronics, physical parts that needed service ... but today's ?
My JR Proposal of the 80's was such an investment - I made sure it had service .. maintenance. It failed only after I left UK and ex-wife consignee it to the shed. Later I rescued it to find corrosion had affected it. McGregor ex Service Mgr checked it over and did his best but its now a shelf ornament. It gave me about 15yrs excellent service. I expect my 9x's and 9xr's to do similar - but well before then I expect to have new radios with new features.
Taranis, FlySky and the 3rd party Firmware guys are spearheading avenues in RC radio that I believe will influence rest of market. Brand names can resist - but eventually like the Auto-market - they will come round.
Division of RC brands that previously were 'joined at hip' is I believe signs of this trend. Finding own slots and trying to decide which way to go.
Futaba has been ducking and diving seemingly no-one at the helm ....
Strangely enough the budget guys have been some if the most stable in staying with a protocol, building and developing ignoring the brand guys 'contortions'.

This is my view and I'm sure there are many that disagree ...

As I say - the main point is today's radio budget or expensive all perform. All work as designed. All should last the course till you want the next step up.

To those looking at radios ... my list is :

A. Model memory
B. Dual rates
C. Expo
D. Size and range of Rx's
E. Versatile programming
F. Price.

Servicing and repair is not anywhere in my list ... in my opinion unnecessary as modern radio is literally in the throw away market now. My $90 9xr far outperforms a DX6 for a fraction of the price. If it fails ... unlikely - but if it does ... I can still buy another and stay under price of the DX6. Ouch ! That'll stir the armies !!


Nigel

Last edited by solentlife; 09-03-2015 at 08:55 AM.
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Old 09-03-2015, 09:12 AM
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The basic rule is:

Buy a better radio than you think you'll need and then you might not need to upgrade for a couple of years.

We commonly hear people wishing they had more features.
We almost never hear people complaining that their radio has more features than they can use.
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Old 09-03-2015, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
The basic rule is:

Buy a better radio than you think you'll need and then you might not need to upgrade for a couple of years.

We commonly hear people wishing they had more features.
We almost never hear people complaining that their radio has more features than they can use.

mmmmmmmmmmmm I think I can safely disagree with that one. I would bet that majority of users out there are not using anywhere near full capability of their radios. That majority would in fact have difficulty actually programming all the capabilities of todays radios ...
Most in fact are 4ch Sunday flyers who add DR and Expo and maybe odd aux ch / mix to their inventory and that's about it.

Nigel
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Old 09-03-2015, 11:24 AM
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dx9 has it all many mixes.. ot her than that a DX6 will fill my needs for a lifetime. I don't need 7 channels or higher
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Old 09-03-2015, 02:42 PM
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DX-18 and I have managed to use all 18 and all of the mix features....

And before the update that increased the number of model memories to 250... I had all the slots filled.

I have NEVER ONCE heard a complaint from anyone that they had too many functions in any radio... I have been asked for help in setting up the best programming for the model.
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Old 09-03-2015, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by fishycomics View Post
dx9 has it all many mixes.. ot her than that a DX6 will fill my needs for a lifetime. I don't need 7 channels or higher
That's fine and many flyers are in that camp. I have many models that sit in the 4ch field ... so my 8ch radios are more than enough.

But it doesn't take much to fall foul of the 6ch limits.

Lets take a sunday sport 4ch machine... and we add a few modifications as many do...

Lets add the split ailerons ............ we now need 5ch.

Lets add retracts ................... we now need 6ch.

Already nothing left.

Personally I feel a 8ch radio is the ideal level for long term use. It gives capability to add facilities without need to sit and hack brains how to do it and not run out of ch's. Even 7ch is limited in my view.

This is my view and I reckon echoed by quite a few others ... look around a flight line and few nowadays are sitting with 5 .. 6 .. or 7ch radios.
A person starting out now and with no radio investment made ... I reckon should set their sights a bit higher than 6ch. That way they can be reasonably sure they don't need to look at replacement for sensible period.

If this was not true - then I suggest the number of 5 and 6ch radios on the second hand market say otherwise.

Just my view ...

Nigel
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Old 09-03-2015, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
DX-18 and I have managed to use all 18 and all of the mix features....

And before the update that increased the number of model memories to 250... I had all the slots filled.

I have NEVER ONCE heard a complaint from anyone that they had too many functions in any radio... I have been asked for help in setting up the best programming for the model.
Who's going to complain.. I replied that majority do not use all the capabilities / features of their radios.

To use all 18 - then I suggest you are exception. Not many need such complexity. I know that I cannot name anyone I know that uses such ...

Nigel
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Old 09-03-2015, 03:15 PM
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Second ... the usual reason for memory full is not full slots ... but no bytes left !!
I'm up against that now ..

Nigel
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Old 09-03-2015, 05:16 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by Dirky View Post
Hi,

Like mentioned in another thread, I've been away too long and plan a restart.

Scrolling through the datasheets of Spectrum transmitters, I kind of loose grip.
Dx6, Dx7, Dx8, Dx9,... I understand, the one has "more" than the other but is that one also "better"? Will a 9 fail less than a 6? Or is quality so good these days that all systems are 99.9999% failsafe?

thanks for all info!
Dirky....I don't know about you, but to me, the vast majority of what I got out of the previous posts only told me "what others like", "what others think", "how much others think they know" and it's really a personal preference........!

To answer the question....."Will a 9 fail less than a 6? Or is quality so good these days that all systems are 99.9999% failsafe?"


Here's a few studies that have been accumulated by various RC vendors and serious RC competitors....:

http://www.rcmodelreviews.com/2.4ghzshootout.shtml

http://www.rcmodelreviews.com/rcupdate.shtml

http://wiki.paparazziuav.org/wiki/RC...ers_and_Radios

I and my RC buddies, rather than refer RC'ers to other forum links, where the same type of responses you got here, are prevalent and the majority, researching data collected by third party published services, tend to give one the bigger picture without to much bias.

Another issue to your question (which has not been covered by any of the previous responses) is type of RX (receiver) you will be required to use with the various TX (radio) models available........their failure rates, availability, size, cost and function rates are just as critical as the TX you choose.....!

As you will find in the above links posted, all of the newer 2.4ghz programmable protocol have very few signal failures when applied to the appropriate craft, physical location, power supply, and use/user ability/knowledge.........as with many of the manufactures, the signal protocol may very between models (DSM2, DSMX Spektrum), (DMSS JR), (S-FHSS, FASST Futaba), (FHSS Airtronics), (GFSK Turnigy)......ect....ect....ect........even "yellow/orange" knock-offs offer various signal protocol.

Cost, availability, service, sustainability, function....... personal desire, need, compatibility and future modification aspects all come into play when choosing a TX/RX system.........I don't believe anyone can legitimately state that any "one" brand of the newer systems are more or less reliable than the other today......it all comes down to ones personal experience and preference.......

Last edited by pizzano; 09-03-2015 at 06:01 PM.
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Old 09-03-2015, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by pizzano View Post

To answer the question....."Will a 9 fail less than a 6? Or is quality so good these days that all systems are 99.9999% failsafe?"


Here's a few studies that have been accumulated by various RC vendors and serious RC competitors....:

http://www.rcmodelreviews.com/2.4ghzshootout.shtml

http://www.rcmodelreviews.com/rcupdate.shtml

http://wiki.paparazziuav.org/wiki/RC...ers_and_Radios
Those posts are some 5 years old. A lot of improvements have been made by many of the RC mfg'rs.

Last edited by kyleservicetech; 09-03-2015 at 07:10 PM. Reason: removed extra text
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Old 09-03-2015, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
Those posts are some 5 years old. A lot of improvements have been made by many of the RC mfg'rs.
If you are referring to the "links" I posted...........

Yep......and the technology of such is becoming even more reliable and available to almost every RC'ers budget.

I posted those links since they will not mislead and provide solid information.....as for newer studies being available by third party observers, the manufactures have become very sensitive about their developments, thus a few law suits (and threats of such) have been floating around, reducing the number of creditable observers (nearly to "0") willing anymore, to publish any research without the consent of the manufacture and in some cases paying an advertising fee......such is the world we live in today...!

Last edited by pizzano; 09-03-2015 at 06:29 PM.
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Old 09-03-2015, 07:02 PM
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The question of failure WAS addressed and bias although evident to a small degree cannot be avoided.

My response and others was basically failure is a rare thing nowadays. So I am confused why P - you should condemn our posts ...
Of course we all talk from personal experience ... why shouldn't we ?

To put it simply ... all todays radios are pretty well sorted and reliable from the budget 6 up to the high falutin mega bucks radios.
The question comes down to buying what is best overall investment to avoid spending again 2 - 3 yrs down the road and my point was the 6's are old hat and in my view not such great buys anymore.
Rx's yes of course ... didn't I mention something like that in my list ?

Isn't it actually funny that I didn't actually say to buy my brand of radio ?

I was de-bunking some of the arguments that come out against budget radio ... in my mind a radio that requires a service agent has most likely killed my model ... AND as I said ... I don't see Service Agents anymore for Specific Name Brand Stereos and TV's etc. other than guys who repair any make.

Given that most clubs / groups know someone who can fix radios ...... I'm again de-bunking that old one.

My advice is that because of todays radios being so reliable ... that a person should not buy because of a brand label ... but because of what he wants from the radio in terms of capability and versatility.

I know I cast my seed on stony ground with some ... but some do take the hint and look around ... instead of just listening to some bod who just says Buy XXXXXX because that's what's in his hands.

If the OP can afford a higher spec Spektrum .. then fair dos .... not my position to dissuade him. I am just pointing out that the world is larger than just one brand.

Nigel
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Old 09-03-2015, 07:13 PM
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My only concern about those budget 2.4 Ghz radios is those transmitters that use the individual flashlight AA batteries for power.

Just my opinion, but the properly welded straps on Nih or Lithium batteries are more reliable than the pressure type contacts for the AA cells.
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Old 09-03-2015, 07:42 PM
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Unless you stand there shaking your TX like you're trying to make a milkshake, the spring based battery holders are fine.

I wouldn't use them for the RX but they used to be commonly used for the RX in glow models before NiCd became popular... and they did fine until G loads ejected the cells from the holder. (we put a rubber band around the holder and that issue was solved too)

The battery retaining system for the TX isn't a big concern.
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Old 09-03-2015, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
Unless you stand there shaking your TX like you're trying to make a milkshake, the spring based battery holders are fine.

I wouldn't use them for the RX but they used to be commonly used for the RX in glow models before NiCd became popular... and they did fine until G loads ejected the cells from the holder. (we put a rubber band around the holder and that issue was solved too)

The battery retaining system for the TX isn't a big concern.
As indicated,
"Just my opinion, but the properly welded straps on Nih or Lithium batteries are more reliable than the pressure type contacts for the AA cells."

It all depends on how well made the AA battery holder is. I just replaced the AA battery holder in my back door electronic lock because of intermittent connections.

Seems the mfg riveted the spring clips through the battery case plastic housing. After a few years that plastic yielded or something, and there wasn't any contact pressure under that rivet.

That said, I've run across spot welded straps on those Nih battery packs where the spot welding wasn't performed correctly. The only thing making contact was the shrink wrap pressing the "welded" contact against the cell.
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Old 09-03-2015, 09:22 PM
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I've had to resolder connectors and repair improperly welded together factory assembled packs... first time I tried to use them

I've also had spring type battery holders last over 30 years. and there's no welded together pack that will last that long.
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Old 09-03-2015, 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Dirky View Post
Hi,

Like mentioned in another thread, I've been away too long and plan a restart.

Scrolling through the datasheets of Spectrum transmitters, I kind of loose grip.
Dx6, Dx7, Dx8, Dx9,... I understand, the one has "more" than the other but is that one also "better"? Will a 9 fail less than a 6? Or is quality so good these days that all systems are 99.9999% failsafe?

thanks for all info!
I've got both the DX8 and DX9 transmitters. Both are good units.

A few months ago, I helped a club member set up the DX9 programming on his giant 150 cc gasser. His transmitter was brand new, and that model was the first programmed into his transmitter. The model had dual aileron servos, dual flap servos, dual elevator servos, three servos on the rudder, and one servo for the throttle. Add to that the throttle kill switch, the timer and voice commands, sub trims of all of the control surfaces, and so on.

Did the whole programming thing without ever opening the DX9 instruction manual. Took about 15 minutes. After doing a few things, I had him do the rest of the programming himself to get familiar with it.

What ever brand transmitter you buy, make certain it is fairly easy to program!
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Old 09-03-2015, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by fhhuber View Post
I've had to resolder connectors and repair improperly welded together factory assembled packs... first time I tried to use them
That's why I solder up my own A123 battery packs, both for backup receiver power, and for powering the electric motor up front. I've even had "No Name" servo extension wires simply pull out of the terminal due to the use of the wrong crimping tool setting. I don't buy ANY of those things anymore.

It's much cheaper than buying ready made, and I know what I've got.

Last edited by kyleservicetech; 09-03-2015 at 10:04 PM.
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Old 09-03-2015, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
My only concern about those budget 2.4 Ghz radios is those transmitters that use the individual flashlight AA batteries for power.

Just my opinion, but the properly welded straps on Nih or Lithium batteries are more reliable than the pressure type contacts for the AA cells.
Only battery related crash I had was a JR factory Rx pack that a welded contact failed. My home made battery packs with spring contacts have never failed.
It is also easy to harden them up by inserting a piece of card to make sure of solid contact into the spring restricting its compression.

Nigel
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Old 09-04-2015, 06:40 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
My home made battery packs with spring contacts have never failed.
Nigel
Home made?

Some of the spring loaded battery holders we have on this side of the big pond are not worth the box they came in. I've thrown out more than a few of them.

Do you have photos of your home made battery packs with spring contacts?
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Old 09-04-2015, 07:55 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by kyleservicetech View Post
Home made?

Some of the spring loaded battery holders we have on this side of the big pond are not worth the box they came in. I've thrown out more than a few of them.

Do you have photos of your home made battery packs with spring contacts?
Not the box ! I'm not that good .....

I take a standard over shop counter battery holder and fit my NiMH .... I use self-amalgamating tape to bind the box and cells. I wrap first end to end and then side to side. The wraps tight to force contacts to stay true to the cells. Also supporting the cable exit.

My last batch were actually the boxes HK sell and work fine.

On my 9x's .... the battery boxes are notorious for the contacts. Its purely that the NiMH cells are a very tight fit in the slots and not able to move to keep pressed. Very simple fix. Narrow folded card inserted into the springs prevent the springs from fully compressing forcing good contact. A trick I learnt from another guy many years ago. My 9x's have had that since first day I bought ... and that's some years now.

Having had my beautiful Royal P51 crashed by a factory Rx pack .... I'm a 'make own pack guy' now.

Nigel
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Old 09-04-2015, 10:03 PM
  #24  
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OK! OK! OK!
So, the answer to my question is actually: "Quality these days is so good I can choose either Spektrum TX"... or any other brand!
Think I'll go for the DX6i... fits best in my budget :-)
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Old 09-04-2015, 10:22 PM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by Dirky View Post
OK! OK! OK!
So, the answer to my question is actually: "Quality these days is so good I can choose either Spektrum TX"... or any other brand!
Think I'll go for the DX6i... fits best in my budget :-)

Good Choice........I like mine......never ever had any issues and only own 8 various planks and quads that I need to program........
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