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Forgot to extend Antenna

Old 08-10-2005, 08:34 PM
  #1  
Douglas
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Default Forgot to extend Antenna

No pictures but I destroyed my Wingo, almost beyond repair. I made the classic newbie mistake, basically because I am a newbie, and forgot to extend my TX antenna. Got about 150 feet away, I was all proud of myself,since I actually got 150 feet without crashing, and then it abruptly did a wing over and crashed nose first full speed into the ground. Foam flying everywhere. All the experienced flyers around me just nodded like they'd been there done that before.

Hopefully it will only take this one lesson. From now on, I do a proper pre flight.
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Old 08-10-2005, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Douglas
No pictures but I destroyed my Wingo, almost beyond repair. I made the classic newbie mistake, basically because I am a newbie, and forgot to extend my TX antenna. Got about 150 feet away, I was all proud of myself,since I actually got 150 feet without crashing, and then it abruptly did a wing over and crashed nose first full speed into the ground. Foam flying everywhere. All the experienced flyers around me just nodded like they'd been there done that before.

Hopefully it will only take this one lesson. From now on, I do a proper pre flight.
OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!! Sorry to hear about that.thats one thing I love about Hitec radios and the Electron RX's they get great range I have flown ly edge before w/o the Tx antenna all the way out.
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Old 08-10-2005, 08:43 PM
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w/o the Tx antenna all the way out
Bad idea - the RF module can heat significantly when the antenna is not fully extended. That and the decrease in range is, as pointed out very painful!

Mike
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Old 08-10-2005, 09:12 PM
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Originally Posted by rcers
Bad idea - the RF module can heat significantly when the antenna is not fully extended. That and the decrease in range is, as pointed out very painful!

Mike
Some people dont belive that though,A guy at my feild one day was programing a plane and I know he was messing with it for an hour or more and had the anntenna all the way down.
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Old 08-10-2005, 11:41 PM
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trogdor
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I've left my transmitter on with fully closed antenna while sitting on the bench for 5 hours after setting up a plane and forgetting about it. No problems many operational hours later. Maybe something heated up but I've not had a problem but who knows one day maybe I'll find out something was damaged!

As for extending the antenna... I'm not a noob but every once in awhile I'll do that too... must look funny trying to get plane pointed up and quickly pulling on the antenna while trying to get back to the sticks as the plane is now diving! No crash but close a couple times!
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Old 08-11-2005, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by trogdor
I've left my transmitter on with fully closed antenna while sitting on the bench for 5 hours after setting up a plane and forgetting about it. No problems many operational hours later. Maybe something heated up but I've not had a problem but who knows one day maybe I'll find out something was damaged!

As for extending the antenna... I'm not a noob but every once in awhile I'll do that too... must look funny trying to get plane pointed up and quickly pulling on the antenna while trying to get back to the sticks as the plane is now diving! No crash but close a couple times!
yeah a guy done this a couple weeks ago at our feild he lanched a IFO and everyone said hey Dont you normally fly with the anntenna out,he looked and said yeah I nomally do LOL,So my father ran over and pulled it out for him.lucky he wasnt flying one of the cheapo GWS RX. cause it would have crashed.
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Old 08-11-2005, 04:35 AM
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Maybe something heated up but I've not had a problem but who knows one day maybe I'll find out something was damaged!
Trust me - it does not do the RF module any good. Talk to any transmitter service center, they will tell you never to run it for any lenght of time with the Antenna fully retracted.

I didn't say it would cook it the first time, just not a good practice.
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Old 08-11-2005, 08:51 PM
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xrbcoronalogoflyer
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Default Never need to extend antenna

here's how i solved the problem of forgetting to extend the tx antenna...works for me!
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Last edited by xrbcoronalogoflyer; 08-11-2005 at 08:54 PM. Reason: add pic
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Old 08-11-2005, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by xrbcoronalogoflyer
here's how i solved the problem of forgetting to extend the tx antenna...works for me!
The antenna on the Heli reminds me of the ones we ran on our Rc boats.and we have thought about getting the rubber ducky ones for the TX but never had I really wish I had one for mu TX when useing the flight Sim
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Old 09-01-2005, 05:50 AM
  #10  
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This is exactly what my brother did on his 3rd flight. Luckily there was no one else around but him and I. Forgot to extend the antenna.
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Old 09-01-2005, 11:37 AM
  #11  
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If anyone knows anything about SWR you would understand why these things heat up. When a signal is sent and can't get out of the box because something is wrong with the antenna system. IE Not matched it will heat up the transmitting object.

In the CB World that would be the radio itself. When that happens parts start quitting. Major parts.

In laymans terms if the Standing Wave Ratio (SWR) is high it is like locking all but one fire escape. Constricting the exit out. Eventually, those (RF) will turn around and go back inside being squeezed back inside and perish.

It is a transmitting thing only and only happens when there is a signal being sent. As soon as you turn on your transmitter it's sending a signal on a frequency that equates to the length of antenna you need to efficiently send that signal. Like CB antenna's on 11 meters they need to equate to at least 102" in the building to get into the frequency range. I put in the building because there are a lot out there that don't realize you have to tune those antenna's when they are actually mounted. Like they tune in the tranmitter with the lenth antenna in the box.

Those that do range checks with the antenna down are in fact transmitting under the high heat conditions. So we know the transmitters will tolerate short term testing under these conditions.

The antenna's on the transmitters are the length they are to transmit in the frequency they are programmed to transmit on.

That is, I hope, a simple explaination for those who want to understand the importance. Hope it is as clear as mud and enlightens at least one I wouldn't understand it if I didn't work on CB's.
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Old 10-21-2005, 12:06 AM
  #12  
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Default Another antenae story

Know what's worse than forgetting to extend your antenna? Standing in the flight box with about 30 people within earshot and yelling "I'm getting hit, I'm getting hit"! Talk about feeling silly.

That was several years ago. Unfortunately, I don't think I am any smarter now, just make new and different mistakes.
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Old 10-21-2005, 12:07 AM
  #13  
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Default Oh, and by the way.............

Yes, I did have my antenna down.....LOL
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Old 10-21-2005, 12:49 AM
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What's even funnier is madly trying to extend your antenna without crashing as your plane is flying away.
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Old 10-21-2005, 01:12 AM
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Reminds me of a couple of days ago while I was at the park with my EFlight Ultimate when the prop flew off. One eye on the plane for a deadstick landing and one eye hoping to catch where the prop., adapter, and spinner might land.

I must admit I spent most of my sight on the plane. With no motor they glide like a water soaked log. Saved them both though, yea!
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Old 10-21-2005, 03:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Combat Drone View Post
Reminds me of a couple of days ago while I was at the park with my EFlight Ultimate when the prop flew off. One eye on the plane for a deadstick landing and one eye hoping to catch where the prop., adapter, and spinner might land.

I must admit I spent most of my sight on the plane. With no motor they glide like a water soaked log. Saved them both though, yea!
Lost a battery that way once. What started out as a dive for a loop ended up being an outside loop (didn't think the plane would do an outside loop! ), battery flew out out the canopy as it came up from the bottom of the loop and glided ever so gracefully off into a field of long grass heading towards the woods inverted (couldn't fly it inverted for more then a couple of seconds because of the dihedral). I was more interested in keeping an eye on the $100 in new electronics in the plane then where the $10 battery went though. :o
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Old 10-21-2005, 03:35 AM
  #17  
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Anybody that says they haven't flown with the Tx Antenna down is fibbing or has a short memory. LOL It is pretty amazing though how far away you can fly one with the antenna collapsed.........

By the way, it's possible to glue that WINGO back together if you collected all the foam pieces.
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Old 10-23-2005, 01:12 AM
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Originally Posted by debhicks View Post
If anyone knows anything about SWR you would understand why these things heat up. When a signal is sent and can't get out of the box because something is wrong with the antenna system. IE Not matched it will heat up the transmitting object.

In the CB World that would be the radio itself. When that happens parts start quitting. Major parts.

In laymans terms if the Standing Wave Ratio (SWR) is high it is like locking all but one fire escape. Constricting the exit out. Eventually, those (RF) will turn around and go back inside being squeezed back inside and perish.

It is a transmitting thing only and only happens when there is a signal being sent. As soon as you turn on your transmitter it's sending a signal on a frequency that equates to the length of antenna you need to efficiently send that signal. Like CB antenna's on 11 meters they need to equate to at least 102" in the building to get into the frequency range. I put in the building because there are a lot out there that don't realize you have to tune those antenna's when they are actually mounted. Like they tune in the tranmitter with the lenth antenna in the box.

Those that do range checks with the antenna down are in fact transmitting under the high heat conditions. So we know the transmitters will tolerate short term testing under these conditions.

The antenna's on the transmitters are the length they are to transmit in the frequency they are programmed to transmit on.

That is, I hope, a simple explaination for those who want to understand the importance. Hope it is as clear as mud and enlightens at least one I wouldn't understand it if I didn't work on CB's.
Being a CB radio operator I totally understand. You always make sure your using the right antenna other wise POOF!!!!! Cloud of smoke
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Old 10-23-2005, 01:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Foamiesrfun View Post
Being a CB radio operator I totally understand. You always make sure your using the right antenna other wise POOF!!!!! Cloud of smoke
That's the magic smoke.
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Old 10-23-2005, 04:28 PM
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I believe one reason that some of us forget to extend the antenna is that it's all but invisible when extended. You may have better results by attaching the banner, that most have received with their radio, to the end of the antenna. It also makes a great wind direction indicator.

JR seems to have the best set-up. It seems to rotate better than other brands.
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Old 10-23-2005, 06:02 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by rcers View Post
Trust me - it does not do the RF module any good. Talk to any transmitter service center, they will tell you never to run it for any lenght of time with the Antenna fully retracted.

I didn't say it would cook it the first time, just not a good practice.
All along while I've been flying R/C (Elvis was the rage in music back when I started) we were told that if you keep the antenna down with the TX on, in due course you'll fry the RF section.

That's what Hal Peterson (may God rest his soul), an authorized Kraft service man in Virginia told us all back in the late '60s. I had no reason to doubt his word back then, and still practice the "pull the antenna up before I turn the TX on". Makes no difference whether I am programming or flying, antenna goes up before I flip the switch to ON.

There are no if, ands or buts about this. I've been told by a few electrical engineers that "it will fry for sure". So why take a chance?
 
Old 10-23-2005, 06:38 PM
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You are right on about extending the antenna.

In the old days the RF output was higher but now seem's to be reduced as the receivers are much more sensative with newer solid state devices that we have . Also FM modulation is much more efficient than the older AM Kraft days, so there is less need for higher power that the Kraft and Proline radios on AM had. I think my proline was half a watt output on AM.

The RF section likes to look at a resonant circut load , that required a fully extended antenna. If the final circut was not resonant the final would draw a lot more current and in time overheat the final RF driver. Even today it is best to extend when the radio is on.
The older radio's had a heat sink to keep the final cool which increased the conductive surface and usually had a star shape device around the final to conduct the heat away.

Were you flying back then? I have about 40 some years in and remember reeds and servo's that were as big as a receiver.

Fred AMA68196
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Old 10-23-2005, 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by N3CLI View Post

Were you flying back then? I have about 40 some years in and remember reeds and servo's that were as big as a receiver.

Fred AMA68196
Fred,

The servos (when I went to servos) I used back then were twice the size of a regular Futaba 127DF RX of current vintage, and were also more than twice the weight. They also had two sliding arms coming out of the metal case to where we hooked up our pushrods. They would be refferred to these days as "linear" output instead or rotary.

Boy, were those things sloooooowwwww!!!!

I also "flew" galloping ghost on my Minnie Mambo and Jr. Falcons, and I say "flew" in quotation because that's what many of them did: they just "flew away". That's when we, the R/C aficionados went on our automatic "chase the runaway plane" mode only to switch to "climb the darn tree" mode or at worse "it's gone and I have to build another one" mode.

Those "modes" kept us in shape. Running around chasing the planes constantly. If we managed to get in one or two flights after many hours of toiling with the things, we were happy, weren't we?

I've been at it with things that fly for 53+ years and haven't begun to tire of it yet!
 
Old 11-01-2005, 06:41 PM
  #24  
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We all have forgotten to extend our antenna...but I belong to an all electric club (www.sarasotasilentflyers.com) and most of our members use the "power stick" antenna that Hobby Lobby sells. It's only 6" high and we get at least 1.5 miles of very good transmission with no glitches.
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Old 11-01-2005, 09:41 PM
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Qban_flyer

You have brought back a memory of my galloping ghost days. We had floor based tx's, (sitting on a 120v battery), with the 'control stick', a pot, mounted on an 'OXO' tin. My friend released his model, then realised he hadn't raised his aerial, only our aerials were goverment supplus ones that pull apart and have a wire running though them, only the bottom section was fixed to the tx.
So I ended up trying to quickly plug the sections together, while my friend tried to fly his plane, we got away with it. Thank heavens for stable single channel jobs.
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