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-   -   WWI planes (https://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=259)

degreen60 05-26-2008 01:52 AM

4 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by matador527 (Post 411443)
I'm still trying to find plans for a Morane Type "L" and/or Fokker D-8, which I can use for trainers.

Here is the Morane Saulnier L I bought that someone else had started. The plans have Peter Rake, Kurt Bengtson, and Bengtson Company on them. I would guess it is a kit from Bengtson Aerodrome. It has a 35" span. It has been modified with ailerons.
The motor and gun are both printed paper glued on foam.
Decals are printed tissue paper.

WWI Ace 05-26-2008 03:41 PM

I've got a few Aerodrome kits Degreen and I like them!! My little green 23"ws tripe is a Bengston kit. Steve

WWI Ace 05-26-2008 03:52 PM

Does your Morane yaw really bad in turns? If you use a pull pull setup like I did you can try this. I cheated and glued a small balsa block under my ailerons to decrease the downward movement of them on my small tripe. Pretty much completely eliminated the yaw and made the plane much easier and better looking in turns. Just glue it to the wing itself so the aileron lays on it like a little shelf. If you have a conventional pushrod setup you'll have to put differential in your ailerons so they move up more than they move down. This can be done on a computer radio if you have one. If not you can move your servo horn on the servo farther "up" and re-adjust your pushrod linkage to get the same effect. Steve

degreen60 05-26-2008 05:11 PM


Originally Posted by WWI Ace (Post 413018)
Does your Morane yaw really bad in turns? If you use a pull pull setup like I did you can try this. I cheated and glued a small balsa block under my ailerons to decrease the downward movement of them on my small tripe. Pretty much completely eliminated the yaw and made the plane much easier and better looking in turns. Just glue it to the wing itself so the aileron lays on it like a little shelf. If you have a conventional pushrod setup you'll have to put differential in your ailerons so they move up more than they move down. This can be done on a computer radio if you have one. If not you can move your servo horn on the servo farther "up" and re-adjust your pushrod linkage to get the same effect. Steve

I am just learning to fly with ailerons so I don't know if it yaws or not. I am too busy just keeping it in the air where I want it. LOL. The person that started the build set the ailerons up for a sevro in the middle of the wing and bell cranks at each aileron so that is what I am using. They are hinged at the top and have an open V. I could probably decrease downward movement by filling the V in some. My the elevator is pull pull and the rudder is fixed. The rudder pull pull is fixed solid in the fuselage. I did that so it will be easy to put in a rudder sevro if needed.

degreen60 05-26-2008 05:21 PM


Originally Posted by WWI Ace (Post 413008)
I've got a few Aerodrome kits Degreen and I like them!! My little green 23"ws tripe is a Bengston kit. Steve

The balsa on my plane seems brittle. If you put preasure on a rib it will break off grain wise. I had to be real carefull finishing the plane. Sence the DR1 plans I have show all the ribs and formers I may just have to start cutting balsa again instead of going the easy route and making it out of foam. I think WW1 planes look good built out of balsa and later planes look better built out of foam. I also have a Fokker DVII I built back in the 70. I am thinking of using the wings(balsa silk covered) and make a new lighter fuselage for it. I scratch built it use plans I drew from 3view. The fuselage is strong enough to take a nitro and kind of heavy for electric.

WWI Ace 05-27-2008 03:44 AM

Remember Degreen, balsa is strong for its weight! Any wood breaks easily grain wise. Go for the DVII sounds like a cool plane!! Steve

jjordison 05-27-2008 03:09 PM

5 Attachment(s)
More progress on the DVa - someday soon I hope to hunting 'English gentlemen' on early patrols with my Jasta 28 colleagues. Top wing completed as well as cabane struts. I plan to go with the Axi 5345/18, 3800W, just to be on the safe side. Regards, Jordy

degreen60 05-27-2008 03:56 PM


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 413519)
More progress on the DVa - someday soon I hope to hunting 'English gentlemen' on early patrols with my Jasta 28 colleagues. Top wing completed as well as cabane struts. I plan to go with the Axi 5345/18, 3800W, just to be on the safe side. Regards, Jordy

You need to cover it with clear, that is just too nice to hide under paint.
Don

degreen60 05-27-2008 04:09 PM


Originally Posted by WWI Ace (Post 413018)
Does your Morane yaw really bad in turns? If you use a pull pull setup like I did you can try this. I cheated and glued a small balsa block under my ailerons to decrease the downward movement of them on my small tripe. Pretty much completely eliminated the yaw and made the plane much easier and better looking in turns. Just glue it to the wing itself so the aileron lays on it like a little shelf. If you have a conventional pushrod setup you'll have to put differential in your ailerons so they move up more than they move down. This can be done on a computer radio if you have one. If not you can move your servo horn on the servo farther "up" and re-adjust your pushrod linkage to get the same effect. Steve

I was looking at my ailerons and remember that when I installed them I set them both a little bit up when centered. I did this to see if it would act like wash out. I bet it acts like differential too cause the ailerons always have more up than down. I one thing I have found on all three of the planes that have ailerons(two I have crashed trying to learn to fly with ailerons, ones wing is still in a tree) they will go into a left bank and I can not get them to change back to level no mater how much I try so I will just bank more left and then I can bank right again.

FlyingMonkey 05-27-2008 05:15 PM

part of that might be torque from the motor.

Voyager2lcats 05-27-2008 05:19 PM

Hey jj, that is a fantastic job you have done there! Beautiful.:$

Bob


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 413519)
More progress on the DVa - someday soon I hope to hunting 'English gentlemen' on early patrols with my Jasta 28 colleagues. Top wing completed as well as cabane struts. I plan to go with the Axi 5345/18, 3800W, just to be on the safe side. Regards, Jordy


degreen60 05-27-2008 06:01 PM


Originally Posted by FlyingMonkey (Post 413562)
part of that might be torque from the motor.

You are probably right, when it happens I could be going too slow and am about to stall. I have found that with the flat wings the planes go into a left diving spin on a full stall. I had to learn to dive to gain speed and not add power.

7car7 05-27-2008 06:43 PM


Originally Posted by degreen60 (Post 413590)
You are probably right, when it happens I could be going too slow and am about to stall. I have found that with the flat wings the planes go into a left diving spin on a full stall. I had to learn to dive to gain speed and not add power.

This all sounds very familiar to me from when I was learning to fly. I started out with a "3D Tiger moth" It was a piece a junk. It was NOT a GWS, but a copy. The motor was underpowered, plane was overweight, and it had 4 ailerons. Not a good combo for someone learning.

I had NO idea that with ailerons, you had to return the plane to level with oposite aileron input. I did eventually get it, about the same time the plane was so overweight from repairs, and had a serious radio range issue. (junky RTF radio). But I kept at it, and now I love ailerons. This was all last September. I guess I learned quick enough. I still fly a 350 Pico TigerMoth, (no ailerons), and love it, but completely enjoy the 4 chanel planes also.

I learned quickly that a slow flying plane without differential is a bad thing if no rudder input is given. I remember being completely baffled as to why the plane did such wierd stuff in the air, until I figured that out.

jjordison 05-28-2008 02:50 PM

Thanks, Don and Bob and all...I originally thought I would build this as a static model, covering and sheeting one side only, leaving the open framework on the other half. But where to display it? I have a loft great room setup so I could hang it from the ceiling, but then who could see the detail? I also stumbled upon a video clip from a gentleman in Germany who was flying a Proctor Fokker DVII on electric power, and the die was cast, as they say.

Voyager2lcats 05-28-2008 04:08 PM

That is great to hear. A beautiful plane like that "needs" to get out and play!;)

Bob


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 414102)
Thanks, Don and Bob and all...I originally thought I would build this as a static model, covering and sheeting one side only, leaving the open framework on the other half. But where to display it? I have a loft great room setup so I could hang it from the ceiling, but then who could see the detail? I also stumbled upon a video clip from a gentleman in Germany who was flying a Proctor Fokker DVII on electric power, and the die was cast, as they say.


WWI Ace 05-29-2008 12:37 AM

I agree!! Take lots of pictures and then fly the crap out of it!! Steve

FlyingMonkey 05-29-2008 01:02 AM


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 414102)
Thanks, Don and Bob and all...I originally thought I would build this as a static model, covering and sheeting one side only, leaving the open framework on the other half.

I have been tempted, that if I was ever to build something good enough to show the interior, that I would cover half in the scale finish, and the other half in a clear covering.

My fiance works for a Boys and Girls club, and has mentioned that she would like me to come speak to the kids there about model aviation. Such a model would be perfect for educational purposes, and then to let them see it fly...

I think that would inspire many to fly RC themselves.

degreen60 05-29-2008 03:14 AM

Just don't fly where my Camel can find it. I would hate to see bullet holes in it.

Bub Steve 05-29-2008 03:14 AM


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 413519)
More progress on the DVa - someday soon I hope to hunting 'English gentlemen' on early patrols with my Jasta 28 colleagues. Top wing completed as well as cabane struts. I plan to go with the Axi 5345/18, 3800W, just to be on the safe side. Regards, Jordy

jjordison::your bout the best dang modeler I've ever seen,, I mean that, your bub, steve

tramp8754 05-29-2008 04:30 AM

DR1 foamy maiden
 
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nt4ZcoWmCOI[/media]

7car7 05-29-2008 07:03 PM

That is one nice looking foamy!

Seems Snoopy has changed teams.

I have 2 CD's by the Royal Guardsmen, and neither have that version. Mostly an instrumental - interesting.

WWI Ace 05-31-2008 04:03 AM

Tramp built a pretty cool tripe!!! Steve

WWI Ace 06-02-2008 01:09 AM

Where did everybody go? Do I stink? I shouldn't, last night was Saturday so I took my weekly bath!!! I just spent my whole weekend putting in new carpet for the wife. Oh well, she's much easier to get along with when I do stuff like this every once in a while. Steve

Biplane Murphy 06-02-2008 01:51 AM

Steve......we are all hiding from Degreen60's Camel....:D:Q:D

tramp8754 06-02-2008 07:05 AM

7car7, rest easy. Snoopy was sent behind enemy lines to liberate the acft. Slight mods have been made since maiden. It should fly even better now.

jjordison 06-02-2008 03:28 PM

5 Attachment(s)
Steve and all - thanks very kindly for the comments. I am NOT that good a modeler, just started with a great kit. What I am is good enough to cover up my mistakes so they can't be seen! A lot of this detail I only got right on the second or third try. There's a limit only on ingenuity - the cone for the radiator pressure tank is a mechanical pencil part.

Question: right now the control surfaces are connected to the stick and rudder bar, but not sure I can successfully add in the servo connections and have a "working" cockpit - may have to just "dummy up" the scale cockpit wires. It would be cool to move the Tx rudder stick and see the rudder bar move, but that may be gilding the lily, so to speak.

Thanks again for the (undeserved) compliments.

And, Degreen60, after we meet I might erroneously claim a "Martinsyde" as having fallen, rather than a Camel!;-) Note the "real" bullets in the photo - helps to model in quarter-scale!!

jjordison 06-02-2008 05:55 PM

And, Don, were I to build a Camel in 1/6 scale, I would have to include a pair of these:

http://cgi.ebay.com/DID-Colman-Vicke...3286.m20.l1116

degreen60 06-02-2008 06:21 PM


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 417108)
And, Don, were I to build a Camel in 1/6 scale, I would have to include a pair of these:


YES, and thread 2451 has the engine you need to power it.


I have found the trees like my planes that have aileron controls. One wing is still up in the tree and I just got my MS-L out of the tree next to it this morning after it spent the night. There must have been a Fokker up high that it was trying to out run.

jjordison 06-02-2008 06:27 PM

1 Attachment(s)
If money were the only object....agree completely, Don!

Not to neglect the Allies completely, here's a digital pic of a pre-digital era snapshot of a 1/5 scale SPAD my late father and I built in the late 90s.

degreen60 06-02-2008 07:00 PM


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 417134)
If money were the only object....agree completely, Don!

Not to neglect the Allies completely, here's a digital pic of a pre-digital era snapshot of a 1/5 scale SPAD my late father and I built in the late 90s.

Where is it now?

I will be going nuts around the 4th of July. My wife told me she don't know what to get me for my birthday and to go buy myself an airplane. Will be in Baton Rouge around the 4th and I will go to Hobby Town. I know they will have several WW1 models. Will be hard to pick just one.

WWI Ace 06-02-2008 07:07 PM

Jordy, nice Spad!! Degreen, are ya gonna eat some mudbugs in Baton Rouge? Steve

degreen60 06-02-2008 07:39 PM


Originally Posted by WWI Ace (Post 417148)
Degreen, are ya gonna eat some mudbugs in Baton Rouge? Steve

I just may. Son has taken me to get mudbugs a couple of times. I always take some WW1 plane to fly with him. Anyone close to Baton Rouge that wants to meet and fly?

jjordison 06-02-2008 08:52 PM

The SPAD is currently - I have no idea. We sold it, not wanting to risk flying it after a guy made us an offer we couldn't refuse. Wish I still had it. Probably hanging from the ceiling in some restaurant in DeKalb, IL or wherever. Made it from plans in RC Modeler in 1995 or so.

Just for fun, I had the guy at our local HobbyTown order me one of the foam SE5a's (not sure who makes it). Our problem is here in Nebraska it's calm three days a year.

jjordison 06-02-2008 08:54 PM

BTW, that is 1:1 scale dust on everything on the DVa cockpit, Spandau's, etc. Need to clean it up!;-)

degreen60 06-02-2008 09:09 PM


Originally Posted by jjordison (Post 417191)
Just for fun, I had the guy at our local HobbyTown order me one of the foam SE5a's (not sure who makes it). Our problem is here in Nebraska it's calm three days a year.

I have the Eflite Jenny and like the way it flys and floats in for a landing. I can fly it in some wind. I have an AX 2306n motor on 2s lipo battery. It will fly at half throtle and when the wind is blowing I can fly it at WOT. I bought 2 of these motors from UH for less than $17 shipped. I have the other one in a GWS Tiger Moth. If the hobby shop has the Eflite SE5a I will sure be thinking about buying it but I am hoping to get a wood plane sence it will be WW1. The wind is almost calm today and I have flown twice so far and hope to fly more this evening when the temp drops. At least I am getting good enough at flying I can stand in the shade of a tree to fly now instead of out in the open in the sun.

50+AirYears 06-02-2008 09:55 PM

Somebody brought up an idea at yesterday's club meeting that recieved favorable comments; Let's have a steak fry combined with a WW I fly-in. If it is in the late September time frame, maybe I could get the Top Flite Red Box SE-5 I have setting in my garage rafters built up. Might run into a conflict, though. With my luck, they'll have the event the week I'll be in SC for my grandaughter's 1st birthday.

WWI Ace 06-03-2008 01:07 AM

Glad to see ya back 50+!!! If I lived anywhere close to Northern Ohio I would love to go to a WWI Fly and Steak Fry!!! Great idea!! Congrats on the grandaughter!! So your about to work on an SE5a huh? Just more planes for my Fokkers to shoot down!!! Where are you Degreen!! Afraid to fly your Camel over my lines!! Steve

50+AirYears 06-03-2008 03:14 PM

Only trouble withthe SE, I picked it up CHEAP ($15.00) from somebody who had assembled a few arfs previously, then found out a "Stick and Tissue" type model was a bit beyond his capabilities. I may actually have to remake some of the sheetwood parts. Kind of a butcher job.

WWI Ace 06-04-2008 12:45 AM

My Grandpa always used to say, "No step for a stepper!!!" Steve

scalercflyer 06-08-2008 04:47 PM

WWI website
 
Boys, make sure you check out the info on this website provided by our good Pal Flying Monkey (thanks much FM!). Wonderful stuff and well worth favorite marking the site. Marty
http://www.ww1accordingtobob.com/


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