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Old 08-19-2016, 04:58 AM   #26
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"There are 2 types of pilots.....those that have crashed and those that will....."
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Old 11-10-2016, 12:08 AM   #27
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Dereck, you've done a great job of explaining the intricacies of setting up the AR636.

A couple of extra bits of info:

1. I'd suggest that after tuning the gains from the Tx using Relative mode, you set the recorded values in the Rx in Absolute mode rather than Relative, so you can't accidentally change them from the Tx until you next want to re-tune.

2. The AR636 is actually a 10 channel Rx, not 6. Of course there are only 6 output ports available for external connection. If you have a Tx with 7 or more channels, you can assign the Flight Mode to one of the higher channels. This means that with an AR636 you can have retracts and flaps connected to the Gear and Aux1 channels (you'd need Y-harnesses for flaps and ailerons too), with the Flight Mode assigned to Aux 2, 3, 4 or 5, depending on the number of available channels in your Tx.
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Old 11-10-2016, 01:09 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by splinters View Post
Dereck, you've done a great job of explaining the intricacies of setting up the AR636.
Thanks but to be honest I still have more questions than answers with regards to Conventional vs Heading Gains. More n that in a minute.

Originally Posted by splinters View Post
1. I'd suggest that after tuning the gains from the Tx using Relative mode, you set the recorded values in the Rx in Absolute mode rather than Relative, so you can't accidentally change them from the Tx until you next want to re-tune.
My bad for not pointing that out long ago. I fully agree turn off Relative Gain once you have optimized the gains. Strictly for test and setup. Disable when not needed.

[QUOTE=splinters;1001375]
Originally Posted by splinters View Post
2. The AR636 is actually a 10 channel Rx, not 6. Of course there are only 6 output ports available for external connection. If you have a Tx with 7 or more channels, you can assign the Flight Mode to one of the higher channels. This means that with an AR636 you can have retracts and flaps connected to the Gear and Aux1 channels (you'd need Y-harnesses for flaps and ailerons too), with the Flight Mode assigned to Aux 2, 3, 4 or 5, depending on the number of available channels in your Tx.
Well budder my butt and call it a biscuit. Are we talking about the same RX? Spektrum clearly states the AR636 is a 6-Channel Sports RX with AS3X. What am I missing? Not that it matters to me if it is 6 or 10 channels with my plane. At least the price has come down $30 since released.

OK what I still have not got my head fully wrapped around is how to use Conventional Gain with Heading Gain and how they interact or don't interact with each other. I can define what each type is, but I cannot clearly state or understand how they should be used with each other, and as of today no one not even from Horizon Hobby can explain it.

Example I have the RX in a PA Addiction X and set up with 3 Flight Modes. FM1 is my Safe Mode, only 30% Rates and NO GYROS, just plane Jane, Tame and Lame. Check got it and understand it.

FM2 is my Sports Mode for fast and precise manuevers and did I mention go fast. 50% rates and only use 25% Convention Gain to make the plain fly on rails and resist wind. At 30% gain I can fly fast without any oscillations. Check got it figured out.

FM3 is 3D Mode super slow flight, and still struggling a bit figuring it out. I am not sure if I should use only Heading Gain which is what I want in 3D, or should Conventional Gain be used with Heading Gain. If so how much of each should be used. No one can answer that to my understanding.

I do no tknow if what I am doing is right or not, but seems to work OK, no texactly what I expect though. I set Conventional Gain = Heading Gain. Pitch = 60%, Roll = 55%, and Yaw = 70%. I have no idea if that is right or not.

With those settings I can Hover or Harrier thumbs off controls except throttle, but will not hold Knife Edges. Makes landing a cinch, just put the plane into high Alpha and let it down with the throttle, or just Hover and snatch the plane out of the air. In calm winds I do not need a runway to take off or land.

Knife Edges require a lot of Yaw input despite high Heading and Conventional Gain settings. Again i do not know if you are suppose to use bith Conventional and Heading gains together, and if so how much of each.
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Old 11-10-2016, 02:45 AM   #29
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Are we talking about the same RX? Spektrum clearly states the AR636 is a 6-Channel Sports RX with AS3X. What am I missing?
You're not missing much. In practical terms it's a 6-channel Rx since there are only 6 ports for connection to flight controls. However, it still decodes 10 channels and you can assign 6 of them to the ports. You can see this in the "Port Assignment & Failsafe" section of the Programmer app. There's nothing you can do with the extra channels apart from deciding which one you wish to use as the Flight Mode & telemetry channel. Note also in the "Models" section that you can specify the number of Tx channels. This is what determines how many Aux channels the app displays in the "Port Assignment & Failsafe" section.

I found the best way to understand how Rate gain & Heading gain interact is to watch the graphical displays in the Programmer as you adjust the sliders for each type of gain. You'll see that within a narrow band either side of stick center, Heading gain (if programmed in) completely takes over from Rate gain. If you set 100% Rate gain and 1% Heading gain, you'll see on the graph how dramatic the changeover can be. This setting would give an insane degree of AS3X stabilization with the sticks off-center, but no stability or heading hold when you let go of the sticks (assuming the plane hasn't oscillated itself into oblivion by then).
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Old 11-10-2016, 03:48 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by splinters View Post
I found the best way to understand how Rate gain & Heading gain interact is to watch the graphical displays in the Programmer as you adjust the sliders for each type of gain.
Doh, the lights just came on. Allow me to paraphrase with what I think you just told me. Correct me if I am wrong or off-track.

Hold Gain is only Active when Hands Off the 3-axis, and Rate Gain is only Active when there is any input from any axis?

Is that correct?

If so makes perfect sense now. So if I am understanding you correctly you want both Rate and Heading Gain should be equal, and Priority adjusted so both Right and Left slopes intersect in the bottom of the respected corners of the graph. Done that way, if you add input, the plane will not fall out of attitude suddenly because Rate Gain was way to low. That would explain a lot of my observations during experiments.

Example I have tried setting Rate to 0% and Heading to 80%. Then do say a Harrier, release the sticks and it holds until wind or some other force causes you to make a correction, and as soon as you touch the sticks, the plane falls out and you must recover before you hit cloud Terra Firma.

Thanks, that was the last piece of the puzzle. But what really chaps my family jewels is the lack of information from the manufacture and supplier who both happen to be you know who. Granted they have a series of videos on the RX, but they do not connect the dots and have detailed info. Flying a Plane to experiment to learn is not a real good idea. You and I both know it is real stupid easy to do something ignorant like set the gains to high with 0% priority is a guaranteed crash taking off because it will never respond to control inputs except throttle.

EDIT NOTE:

FWIW to anyone who is buying a AS3X RX or getting ready to set one up here is the best tip you will ever get. Go easy and slow turning up the Gains. Leave Priority set to 100%. Start at say 10% Gain and work your way up. If you are a Bone Head and initially set the Gains to high, the plane can tear itself apart from violent oscillations, or will not respond to control inputs.

Second Tip and just as important is Make Flight Mode 1 Your SAFE MODE. That warm comfortable place you are so familiar with. No Gyros or Gains set, reduced throw rates, and enough Expo for that silky smooth precise control. Trust me you need this. If you fly a plane as agile as mine, a PA Addiction X, can generate extreme G forces that make the Gyros go STUPID and you cannot control it. FM1 is your friend, keep him by your side, you will likely need him.
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Old 11-10-2016, 04:25 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by dereckbc View Post
Doh, the lights just came on. Allow me to paraphrase with what I think you just told me. Correct me if I am wrong or off-track.

Hold Gain is only Active when Hands Off the 3-axis, and Rate Gain is only Active when there is any input from any axis?

Is that correct?
Well, not quite. If you don't add any Heading gain (0%), then the Rate gain will still be in effect at stick center. But as soon as you add Heading gain it will override the Rate gain at stick center. Again, this will be obvious when you watch the graphical display of rate settings in the app.
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Old 11-10-2016, 07:31 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by splinters View Post
Well, not quite. If you don't add any Heading gain (0%), then the Rate gain will still be in effect at stick center.
OK got it. My assumption was Heading Gain is turned on and by that logic Heading Gain setting is greater than 0%. At 0% means Heading Gain is turned off. Thank you I now have all the pieces. It confirms my trial and error experiments. It confirms Rate Gain should equal or roughly equal to Heading Gain when both are used together. It also tells me Heading Gain should be equal or greater than Rate Gain when used together. At least for my preferences and expectations works best.
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Old 11-12-2016, 07:58 PM   #33
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Default AR636 FM settings for 3D Hummer

This thread is quite useful to me since I have five models that use the Horizon 'stabilized' receivers; P51, SportCubS, Apprentice, T28, EStik, . Four have the SAFE version of the receiver and allows me to fly them with more confidence in windy conditions and to use for training. The P51 has the factory programed AR636 with the three Flight Modes programmed as part of the 3-position Flap settings. Having peeked into the Receiver Setup, I have a starting point for using a 'blank' AR636 receiver for my HK Hummer 3D plane.

You can find my P51 AR636 Settings summary through this link: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...postcount=1093

The initial AR636 FM settings for the HobbyKing Hummer worked quite well and they are summarized as follows:
FM Switch is assigned to AUX1 Switch D on my DX6 Transmitter
Roller Switch is used to adjust Receiver Gains from the Transmitter (Gains in Relative Mode on Receiver). This allows me to reduce/increase the Gains for each flight mode which is useful to eliminate Oscillation.
Receiver Orientation matched mounting orientation in plane
Surface Setup: Tuned Reverse, Subtrim and Travel (should not adjust these in the Transmitter)

FM1 is my 'SAFE FLYING' Mode where the Travel and gains are modest. I usually start my takeoff and flying in this mode. Even with the reduced travel, I can do most acrobatics. The plane is the most stable and easy to control in this mode.
Rate Gain: 50%Roll 50% Pitch 50% Yaw
Head Gain: 0% for All (I will use this gain only for 3D Mode Flying)
Priority: 150%
D/R: 50/50 for All
EXPO: 50/50 for All

FM2 is may 'FAST Acrobatic FLYING' Mode where the rate Gain is lower to reduce chance of Oscillation at higher speeds and where the Travel is Higher (D/R) for more aggressive maneuvers. The plane can do extreme 3D maneuvers in this mode but has no "Heading Gain" to help in Hovers, Knife Edge Flying, etc.
Rate Gain: 30%Roll 30% Pitch 30% Yaw
Head Gain: 0% for All (I will use this gain only for 3D Mode Flying)
Priority: 150%
D/R: 70/70 for All
EXPO: 30/30 for All

FM3 is may 'Extreme 3D FLYING' Mode with high Rate Gains and high Heading Gains and where the Travel is Highest (D/R) for more aggressive 3D maneuvers at slow to medium speeds. This mode makes it easy to hold a vertical hover even in wind and to fly in a knife-edge position.
Rate Gain: 70%Roll 70% Pitch 70% Yaw
Head Gain: 70% for All (I will use this gain only for 3D Mode Flying)
Priority: 150%
D/R: 100/100 for All
EXPO: 0/0 for All

The learning from 30 flights includes:
1. Wait for the AR636 Receiver to stabilize (cycle the controls) before moving the plane. One flight was quite unstable because the Elevator kept drifting ... I was in a hurry and moved the plane before it fully initialized.
2. I had to reduce the Rate and Heading gains in FM3 (3D mode) due to pronounced Aileron Oscillation. In 'Relative Mode', I reduced the R/H gains from 100% to 70%.
3. One of the Aileron Servo's had a stripped gear. Could have been caused by hanger rash or due to 3D mode Oscillation.

Trust, but Verify!
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Old 11-12-2016, 10:22 PM   #34
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Having had some experience with Horizon's 636 & AX3S installed on +30" and Carbon Z 78" wingspan planes (DX6i & DX7/8 TX's)......the information dereckbc, splinters and raming have and continue to provide through-out this thread has been tremendous........!

I and my bashful buddies have/had spent several hours weeding through various forums (to include RCG) gathering bits and pieces of information (filtering through the BS) to get to a place where this thread has taken us.......all of you should be commended for such......very to the point, no nonsense or bravado, no whining about the pit-falls.......just "here are the issues", "here's how you overcome such"..........I personally thank each for the time you've spent and the knowledge you have passed on without the need for argument or a pat on the head.......Thank You....!
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Old 11-12-2016, 11:51 PM   #35
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Pizzano, you are very welcome and thanks for the kind words.
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Old 11-13-2016, 12:30 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by raming View Post
FM1 is my 'SAFE FLYING' Mode where the Travel and gains are modest. I usually start my takeoff and flying in this mode. Even with the reduced travel, I can do most acrobatics. The plane is the most stable and easy to control in this mode.
Rate Gain: 50%Roll 50% Pitch 50% Yaw
Head Gain: 0% for All (I will use this gain only for 3D Mode Flying)
Priority: 150%
D/R: 50/50 for All
EXPO: 50/50 for All
Do not think you can call that a SAFE MODE with Gyros turned on. I suggest you reconsider and make it a real SAFE MODE and turn both Rate and Heading Gains OFF.
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Old 11-13-2016, 12:51 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by dereckbc View Post
Do not think you can call that a SAFE MODE with Gyros turned on. I suggest you reconsider and make it a real SAFE MODE and turn both Rate and Heading Gains OFF.
I guess when you get to the point where the experimenting is over and you are comfortable with the settings, you could treat it as a "safe" or "normal" mode. I actually feel "safer" when flying in windy conditions by having a moderate amount of rate gain dialled in. It depends on how you define "safe":
a) Safe as in knowing that there are no gains set that could cause problems
b) Safe as in knowing that AS3X is your friend when flying conditions are less than ideal.

The e-Flite SAFE models have gains dialled in for every flight mode. Their definition of "safe" is the ability to recover in a panic situation through the use of AS3X.

But I heartily agree with your suggestion to have a flight mode totally devoid of all gain settings while you are setting up AS3X in a new model.
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Old 11-13-2016, 01:36 AM   #38
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Default True SAFE mode

Originally Posted by dereckbc View Post
Do not think you can call that a SAFE MODE with Gyros turned on. I suggest you reconsider and make it a real SAFE MODE and turn both Rate and Heading Gains OFF.
Actually, I agree! Thank you for your advice.

My track record with custom programmed AR636 planes has not been excellent: Had a catastrophic crash due to an Aileron Failure due to oscillation and tried to overcome tip-stall tendencies with a large wing-area PiperCub without success.

So, sharing and contrasting advice is what I am looking for!

Thanks again.

Trust, but Verify!
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Old 11-14-2016, 01:11 AM   #39
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Default Flying without AR636 FM settings for 3D Hummer

I had an opportunity to Maiden a club member's new Hummer which was configured virtually the same as mine. The only major difference was that his Receiver was not Gyro Stabilized.

The first flight was very difficult to control. The plane was extremely sensitive in the Roll and Pitch axes and I was happy to get it down in one piece. The plane was setup without EXPO and with moderate Control Throws (about the same as my Hummer's AS3X FM2). The second flight was conducted with 50% Expo's and about 1/2 of the control throws. It was much more stable but still very sensitive to control inputs. The flying conditions were ideal (less than 5mph winds).

I seem to be a much better and more confident pilot with my AS3X settings! My Hummer flew very aggressively with Harrier's, Inverted Flight, loops etc. on the same day.

So, this "Apples to Apples" comparison has me sold on the benefits of a properly adjusted AR636 Receiver!

Trust, but Verify!
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Old 01-12-2017, 10:01 AM   #40
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Default Anymore on Priority

This has been the most illuminating thread on the setting up of AS3X. I only stumbled on it after many weeks of torturous study and experiment with a couple of rebuilds thrown in for good measure. Having done the work and conquered the suffering I find this brilliant thread. Much of what you cover I discovered the hard way somits good tonthe the reason behind the action.

'To cut to the chase' . . . I still don't understand the Choice in Priority! I understand the why but it's the 150/160% setting. How can you have more than 100%. Manufacture setting I have seen are 150ish. Why not 100%

Look forward to sorting this one out.
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Old 01-12-2017, 02:49 PM   #41
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Default Priority Setting

From this link you can get my thoughts on what the "priority Setting" does:

[QUOTE=raming;1001403]
You can find my P51 AR636 Settings summary through this link: https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...postcount=1093

"The high Priority Settings seem to ensure that at 'centered stick' the stability system is active while not active when moving the sticks for acrobatics."

For example, 150 allows the plane to be rock steady when the transmitter sticks are not moving but allows fast changes to the controls with small stick changes. Moving the values down (to 100) will 'dampen' the stick so that larger movements are needed to change the plane's attitude.

Trust, but Verify!
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Old 01-12-2017, 04:11 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by davidmelville View Post
'To cut to the chase' . . . I still don't understand the Choice in Priority! I understand the why but it's the 150/160% setting. How can you have more than 100%. Manufacture setting I have seen are 150ish. Why not 100%
Perhaps a different POV might help. Open up the AS3X app on a PC or even cell phone. I never got the cell phone app to work. Anyway go to Priority and Heading Gains and let's play a little on a dummy or test model.

On any axis you choose, set Rate, Heading, and Priority to 100%. As you look at the graph to the right of the settings, the Horizontal X Axis (right to left) is your stick position where the center is the center stick position, and right and left are obvious.

The Vertical Y axis (up and down) is your Gain for both Rate and Heading. With me so far? If not keep re-reading until you got it.

OK you should be looking at what looks like a Pyramid with Flat Top. The Flat Top is the Heading Gain and the Slopes on either side is Rate Gain.

Now move Priority down toward 0% and observe what happen to the Rate Gains, the slopes on either side. They flatten out and the Rate Gain goes to 100% when you hit 0% Priority. If you were to do that, you would have no control of the airplane regardless of how far you moved the stick off center. At take off you plane becomes a Juggernaut and plows straight ahead no matter how hard or fast you pull back on the Elevator. All you could do is cut the throttle and pray it stops before it collides with something.

OK now priority up above 100% and observe. The Rate Gain Slopes steepen. Go to 200%. What do you see? You should be looking at a long rectangle standing on its short side. There is no Rate Gain period. All you have is Heading Gain, and Heading Gain is only active when the stick is centered. Touch the stick and essentially you have turned off the gyros because there is no Gain. You could actually fly this way and kind of similar to a real plane Auto Pilot. When the sticks are centered, The plane will hold its pitch, roll, and yaw as long as the stick is centered. Touch a stick and you turn Auto Pilot off and the plane is under your control until you recenter the stick again. It would be strange and awkward, but you could fly it.

Now dial back priority to 150% and observe. You are looking at a Wedge with a Flat Top right? When you move the stick off cent you have Rate Gain but the slope is rather steep and once you get the stick position to about half way on either side, Rate Gain drops off to 0% and again essentially turns off the Gyros.

Back to 100% Priority and our Flat Top pyramid. The slop is 45 degrees and hits the corner of the graph. As you move off-center, Rate Gain decreases. To fully turn off Rate Gain you would have to move the stick to the fullest extent. IMO and you will likely share my opinion later is you want to move Priority above 100% like 125 to 150%. It is a very desirable and controllable feel to it. In fact required for 3D Extreme Maneuvers like Tumbles, Snap Rolls, Water Falls, Blenders. Walls, etc. If you had the gyros turned on would dampen the movement so much would not allow you to do Extreme 3D Maneuvers.

Hope that helps.

Dereck
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Old 01-12-2017, 04:27 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by pizzano View Post
I and my bashful buddies have/had spent several hours weeding through various forums (to include RCG)
You are welcome.

RCG really frost my pumpkin at times and this is one of those subjects that just put my pumpkin in the deep freeze. Completely worthless and unusable. I tried to start a thread on this, and two minutes later the Cheat Beating Silver Back Gorillas jumped in and basically said there was already a thread opened and my questions and opinions should go into the AS3X Thread they started. Over 900 pages of useless Chest Beating and pure garbage.
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Old 01-12-2017, 04:33 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by splinters View Post
I guess when you get to the point where the experimenting is over and you are comfortable with the settings, you could treat it as a "safe" or "normal" mode. I actually feel "safer" when flying in windy conditions by having a moderate amount of rate gain dialled in.
I understand completely, and I land in FM2 when windy. FM2 is pretty tame and lame. The issue for me is experience, gyros go STUPID from time to time especially if you willingly or accidentally do a high G maneuver like a Tumble or Blender. Sometimes they just go Crazy.

When and if that happens and do not have a mode with gyros turned off. you are now the proud new owner of toothpicks and crumpled up cellophane, or packing peanuts.
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Old 01-13-2017, 04:28 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by dereckbc View Post
I understand completely, and I land in FM2 when windy. FM2 is pretty tame and lame. The issue for me is experience, gyros go STUPID from time to time especially if you willingly or accidentally do a high G maneuver like a Tumble or Blender. Sometimes they just go Crazy.
That's where the priority setting comes in. If you have AS3X in a model capable of 3D maneuvers, you should be reducing the gain to zero whenever stick movement is significant. And of course, you would disable rate gain altogether in the mode you set up for 3D.

Another tip is to mix the throttle to the gain so the gain is reduced as the throttle is increased above a certain value, e.g. 50%. We know that high gain and high speed are a dangerous combination. It's a bit tricky to set up, but certainly possible.
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Old 01-13-2017, 01:41 PM   #46
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Thanks so much for your expansive replies, they are so useful.

I fly mostly gliders, like Radian Pro and Graupner V Venture, I have just added a Parkzone Sport Cub and mess about with a Delta Ray.

My main 'study' is the Radian Pro and using AS3X is a real advantage, despite what the purists say but then I'm not a purist! The information on Priority is I think crucial. Heading gain for landing is what I'm working on and the Priority needs to be right.

Now the Conscendo is out I'm trying to find out the settings and hopefully someone will reveal them as they will be a good reference.

Once again thanks . . . .
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Old 01-13-2017, 04:07 PM   #47
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Default Heading Gain . . . Priority

Once again so many thanks for all the input, it's absolutely invaluable.

But naturally it raises more questions! So here's today's . . . .

In FM3 I have set my heading gain to 50% and my rate gain to 40% with Priority at 150%. Now this is for pitch, yaw & roll.

With yaw and throttle sharing the left stick I don't want to stop gain control when I throttle back. So should I remove heading gain on yaw so that the stick does not stop gain when altering throttle or will just touching the stick stop gain anyway.

Thanks
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Old 01-13-2017, 07:41 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by davidmelville View Post
In FM3 I have set my heading gain to 50% and my rate gain to 40% with Priority at 150%. Now this is for pitch, yaw & roll.
Well there is no right answer. You have to decide if you have Roll, Pitch and Yaw. It can be one axis, two axis, or all three. Whatever you want and decide to do.

Originally Posted by davidmelville View Post
With yaw and throttle sharing the left stick I don't want to stop gain control when I throttle back. So should I remove heading gain on yaw so that the stick does not stop gain when altering throttle or will just touching the stick stop gain anyway.
OK first unless you specifically set up gains to react to throttle, altering throttle does nothing to either Rate or Heading Gain. You have to make it do that in Setup. Never done it myself. So unless you have set that up, does not apply

Again you need to understand the difference between Conventional Rate Gain and Heading Gain. Heading gain is only active when that specific stick axis is Centered. Example if you input say Elevator, does not disable Heading Gain in Ailerons and Rudder, only Elevator. When Centered, only Heading Gain is active. As soon as you move the stick off center, Heading Gain is turned off, and IF you have Rate Gain set, then it becomes active when the stick is off center. Either or, not both.
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Old 01-13-2017, 07:57 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by davidmelville View Post
Once again so many thanks for all the input, it's absolutely invaluable.

But naturally it raises more questions! So here's today's . . . .

In FM3 I have set my heading gain to 50% and my rate gain to 40% with Priority at 150%. Now this is for pitch, yaw & roll.

With yaw and throttle sharing the left stick I don't want to stop gain control when I throttle back. So should I remove heading gain on yaw so that the stick does not stop gain when altering throttle or will just touching the stick stop gain anyway.

Thanks
Hi David, the throttle channel has no effect on gains (unless you specifically set up a mix between throttle and the FM channel). You just need to be careful that you don't apply any sideways movement to the throttle stick to the point that the heading gain is cancelled. I actually increased the spring tension on the rudder gimbal to minimise unwanted movement.

Also, keep in mind that movement of either pitch, roll or yaw away from centre will cancel heading gain for ALL control surfaces.
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Old 01-13-2017, 08:19 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by splinters View Post
That's where the priority setting comes in. If you have AS3X in a model capable of 3D maneuvers, you should be reducing the gain to zero whenever stick movement is significant.
I agree and why I use roughly 150% Priority.

Originally Posted by splinters View Post
And of course, you would disable rate gain altogether in the mode you set up for 3D.
Now we part ways. Example say you are in high alpha like a Harrier, and the nose starts to fall off. Under that condition Heading gain is going to have significant Elevator Up while stick is centered. Touch the stick to correct, and the plane is going to Fall out quickly, it would cause you to Jerk the stick back and over correct flipping you over.

When I talked to the Guru at HH (cannot recall his name but is the guy that did the videos on the AR636 tutorials) when I first did this I asked specifically about Conventional and Heading Gains in 3D modes and was told Heading Gain should be = Rate Gain. That way when you make a correction, especially minor corrections, the plane will not fall out and cause you to to over react. He said set them equal and start with 125% Priority, then fine tune it (Priority up or down) to do what you want to feel like.

Originally Posted by splinters View Post
Another tip is to mix the throttle to the gain so the gain is reduced as the throttle is increased above a certain value, e.g. 50%. We know that high gain and high speed are a dangerous combination. It's a bit tricky to set up, but certainly possible.
First I have heard you can do that. I can certainly see that in my FM2 mode or Sport Mode where I use no Heading Gain. So I can see how that would work out OK.

However I see big issues in FM3 my 3D Mode. However not so much in 3D. My Addiction X has plenty of Power and I can Hoover with just under half throttle. I want more gain in Post Stall and 0 airspeed, not less. Perhaps I am over looking something, but for me 3D is all very slow or no airspeed and does not require much throttle to do that. If I had a less powerful motor that required the throttle to be at or near full power to hold a Hoover, last thing I want is less Heading Gain. Just as well not have gyro RX because then it is all you keeping it where you want. I can put my plane in a Hoover and set the TX on the ground or behind my back if I wanted to show off. Thumbs off.
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